What 27 Years in Beauty Taught Jeanette About Success and Authenticity

 hair and beauty get lumped in together a lot.

Yep. But it's actually very, very different worlds.

 coming back to being authentic. Yeah. Whoever you are, just show up as whoever you are, which a lot of people are frightened to do, Yeah.

Your people will find you.

 If you can nail what that person's , pain point or problem, or ideal outcome is Yep. Then people will make sure they find the money. To pay for that. Absolutely.

 We didn't enter the beauty industry.

Because we wanted to do finances. Yeah. We want to be tangible and tactile yeah. You realize when you have a business, that's what you need.

 People have such a fear of numbers. Numbers can be your friend. Numbers don't lie. I think that's the catchphrase we're gonna take today.  Numbers don't lie.

 That's the thing with everything. Yep. It's about building connections.

 I'm lying there having a facial and the next one over, they're doing a lash extension and they're having a good old chat and it's like, it's not what I came here for.

 It's about having clients that value Absolutely. You. Yep. There's no point in trying to attract people that don't see any value in you.  The only way you're gonna grow is if you're uncomfortable.

Yeah. So you've got to  get comfortable with being uncomfortable. That's it.

  📍 📍

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Welcome back to the Inner Sanctum Salon, rising the podcast.

I'm a flying solo today as I welcome our special guest, which is Jeanette. The general manager of Salon First in Melbourne. That's right. Yeah. So Salon First is a distribution company. Beauty Wholesaler. Yes. Beauty wholesaler. Yeah. Okay. We were just having a chat prior to coming on about what Salon First used to be named and back in the day, what was it?

s. So what year was that? Uh,: 1989

Wow. I know. I don't look that old, do I? But No. Yeah, no, thank you. Exactly. I was a baby when I started, , and I've had my babies while I was there. Yeah. So my babies are 21 and 25 now, so, oh my goodness. Still living at home. But your background wasn't in beauty, correct? No, it was in, uh, business and administration.

So yeah, I was employed as the bookkeeper, so Wow. Kind of got all that sorted out sort of. Yeah. So did you feel like you had an affinity with the industry as well? Like, or do you think that's kind of grown not really with the role that you stepping into? I think it's grown with the role. Yeah. I really knew nothing about the beauty industry.

I'm not that person that has their nails done. And primarily that's where we started as a business was Yeah. Nails. Were you still back scratches when you started? Yes. Yeah. Yeah. We were still back. Scratches. Yep. Back scratches. Nail care. Wow. And back scratches is a brand in America that one of our directors, uh, Beth started to import, uh, with the help of her business partner at the time, George.

So they own the company. They were partners in life. They're not anymore, but they're still business partners. So that's a kind of a, a test to the relationships that they like, isn't it? So, yeah. Yeah. It doesn't mean they don't fight, but no, they're they're very two different brains. So yeah, potentially if you've had that background though, it could make those challenging fights and conversations easier.

I would maybe say, I mean, who knows? Okay. So you've been working in this company with this couple turned, not couple turned business partners for 27 years. So clearly it's a, it's a great place to work to have stayed for that long and you've kind of developed this, obviously growth within the company to get to where you are.

Yeah. So it tried change over time and yeah, we've kind of expanded and probably recently post COVID contracted like this. Really? Yeah. To market at one stage, I think we had seven showrooms across Australia, so Right. We had, uh, went in Brisbane in Marca, so it's south side of Brisbane, seven Hills, which is in Parramatta.

Mm-hmm. We had a story in Adelaide. We had at one time four stores in Melbourne. 'cause Melbourne's kind of where we were bred from, so, yeah. And so what have you contracted to now? Yeah, so we, one, so we have one location in Melbourne where I am, so, which is our national sort of head office. We've got a big warehouse like ad inhouse, square meter warehouse and things.

So yeah, I feel like with the way the distribution's gone, like that's all you really need now. Right? Yeah. That's, do you agree that's, yeah. COVID taught people to shop differently. Yeah. And to interact differently with business. And you know, at one stage we were open seven days a week, probably a bit like here you've contracted, we stopped Sundays, we stopped Saturdays, but we're open a little bit longer during the week, like, you know, eight to five and.

You just have to change to, yeah. You'd have to drag some of your customers along kicking and screaming. But it's definitely the way otherwise you just don't change and you don't grow. Right. That's right. Yeah. You just stay stagnant and, and some people will kick and scream and not come along for the journey.

Mm-hmm. And I think part of growth is accepting that that's gonna happen. Yep. And moving forward anyway. Yep. Yep. You have to have a bit of a vision about what it's gonna look like. Yeah. Or what you have hope to get to. And it might not get there. It might change, but yeah. You have to have a reason behind it, so.

Absolutely. Yeah. Okay, clearly you've been in the beauty industry for quite some time now. Quite some time. Yep. I've been in the hairdressing industry for quite some time, so it gives us that sort of insight into the growth and change. And we were talking about the.

You know what's hot, you know? So when the business started. Yeah. Obviously nails were the big thing business, right? Yeah. Yep. And I wouldn't say that nails aren't hot now, but like just watching those trends of, you know, what you're really focusing on. Yep. And I mean, what gets all the attention?

Yeah. What's screaming the loudest in the marketplace, basically. So, so what do you I know what I think in my head. Mm-hmm. I know what I think is screaming the loudest in the beauty industry at the moment. Yeah. What do you think is screaming the loudest in the beauty industry? Well, there's two different sort of camps, I guess, and one is, uh, lash and Brow.

Mm-hmm. So as a standalone service, as a lash and brow bar. So you're not a beauty therapist, you're not doing everything. That's all you do. So really niching down to that. And the other one is skin. Yeah. Skin aesthetics, Germal. Clinicians, they're therapists. Skin is, they're germal clinicians. Big resurgence, I reckon.

Yeah. Very big. Like potentially in a way that I don't think we've seen before. I had, I, again, potentially post COVID feel like skin is really having a moment and it used to be all about stripping everything away and now it's about, yeah. No, it's about, understanding the skin barrier.

Yeah. I also think the, the public has changed. They're, they're more educated about ingredients, about, you know, and that's the internet in your hand, I guess. Yes. That's educated them about that. Good ways and bad ways. , I think it's, it's probably across all demographics, but, , there's more disposable income.

As much as I know people are doing it tough with, you know, mortgages and things. They sort of cherry pick what they spend that money on and, and it's self-care. I know think that's such a key thing because we hear this so much, you know, recession. Recession, and no one's got any money, but we're still really discerning about what we're spending our money on, right?

Yeah, absolutely. And if you can nail what that person's , pain point or problem, or ideal outcome is Yep. Then people will make sure they find the money. Yes. To pay for that. Absolutely. Yep. It's a little bit about finding, well, who, who is your ideal customer to, yeah. And then go and market to that.

Don't, you don't need to be everything to everybody, so, yes. Who, who do you wanna attract to your salon on? So the, you know, semi-retired or on the way to retirement person that's maybe has a bit more money or a 30 something sort of up and coming, , that's probably a bit more dynamic in doing home care as well as.

In. Yeah. And they want it to be an experience. That's the other thing too. Yeah. So it's not just in and out and in a sort of noisy salon, like having the space design properly is important. The whole journey is important from the time we were talking about this prior to coming on, because I,

I,

as you said, hair and beauty get lumped in together a lot.

Yep. But it's actually very, very different worlds. Well, they don't really overlap when you really think about them. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yep. Like, except for the aesthetic aspect of it. Right? Yeah. Yep. But , it's so different. Just even down to the fact that you said like hairdressers talk. Yeah. People listen to this podcast like, you know, and I have this in the podcast before, but clearly I've binged it a lot beforehand.

It's like, yeah, you, you girls know how to control the conversation . And reminds the experience of being , the client in the chair going, yep. The hairdresser controls the conversation and, and dries it. Yeah. So where, yeah. Beauty is very opposite. It's, it's quiet. It's, you know, you can choose to have a quiet appointment if you want to these days.

And yeah, it's a very different vibe. I mean, we do offer that as in the hair as well, but I think in the atmosphere it's quiet. Very hard. It's very hard to, you know. Yeah. So it's, it's still a buzzing. I mean, we've got blow dryers. Blow dryers are loud. Yep. But I find it really interesting now that we are seeing a lot of these coworking spaces that are combining the beauty and hair side of things.

I don't know, and this might be controversial, just please don't come at me in the comments. Oh, you can, it's fine. But I don't know that they actually combine very well. No. Environmentally. Environmentally. Yeah. Yeah. Like you are, you are not got one client in a room with four walls like you are. Yeah.

You are next to it in a chair with someone, whether it's at the basin or the, OR in front of the mirror. Yeah. And you are over overhearing conversations and Yeah. It's very different. You've got blow dryers going and Yeah. I know when I was in a coworking space, I was really conscious of that. Like you've got that door, that door that's rolled shut next to you that, you know, you've got someone performing some sort of like beauty experience in behind that one cavity slider door and just thinking, that's not blocking all of this out.

No, and I've been in salons where, you know, they're retrofitted but the walls don't go to the ceiling. They're just those sort of three quarter walls and I'm lying there having a facial and the next one over, they're doing a lash extension and they're having a good old chat and it's like, it's not what I came here for.

Like, you know, I wanna to feel free to wake me up when it's done kind of thing. Oh yeah. Yeah. So that's my vibe when I go to incel is just. A bit more wellness a bit more. Yep. So do you feel like the, the customers that are coming to you, guys that are looking for like product and support and all that sort of thing, is that what they are aiming to create for their clients?

Yes and no. Again, it depends on where they're located, you know? Yeah. Clearly pretty know our Melbourne salons pretty well, but you know, if you're like in a city you have a whole different vibe. Yeah. You're very much, you know, clean skin, vegan, you know, has to tick a lot of boxes in that way. Yes.

And then you have the ones in the suburb who really do try and cater for everything. You know, they, they want to have as many services as possible to get as many clients as possible. 'cause that's the way that they're thinking. But yeah. Yeah. Different people are niching down. Like I said, it's if you become, if you don't offer that, if you just sort of become an expert at something, you can and lashes. Right. Like brows and lashes are a completely different beast. They are. Yep. I find more and more so now not, you find a lot of girls don't have a beauty background.

Like they might not have done a diploma or anything of beauty. So, yeah, they just sort of stumbled over or they've learned lash extensions and I think a lot of lash and brow came from lash extensions. 'cause that was sort of agreed. The e sort of 10, seven years ago, that was where the, the peak was and and that's kind of fallen away

but harking back, when we look at this evolution of brows, like we've come a long way from the $10 brow wax, right? 10 brow wax. Yep. Putting ash on. Ran your brows, get brows, get overflow of tint off sort of thing.

There was no paste, there was no, you know, mapping stream, mapping there. No, there's no mapping. And a lot of artists still don't do that. Like you find old school, they not twins, they're sisters, you know, like, they don't necessarily want to be symmetrical as much as beauty's always sort of defined as being symmetrically beautiful.

That's what people are trying to aspire to. But yeah, it's changed a lot. No, no longer if you're doing a $10 wax, please take it off your menu. Like you need to be Yeah. Doing a experience, but putting it all together as a package to go, no, I don't just do brow waxing.

I do, yeah. A brow sculpt and dye. Or like, it's, you know, I do from start to finish and send you home with aftercare too. And it's, you know. $180. Yes. Yes. And that's why your face looks so amazing, because as they say, your eyebrows are like the curtains. Mm-hmm. You know, they frame your face, don't they?

They frame, yeah. When you're in the house and you hang the curtains and that's what brings the look together. Your eyebrows are that for your face. Yep. And it's funny, I've got a lot of friends mostly through the work that we've done through Salon Rising in the brow and lash industry.

And so I have young ones coming, and speaking to me about how they want to get into the brow and lash industry and what they should be doing. And I do think, as you were saying before, it's so different. I think it needs to be a completely different thing. I've had young ones say to me, or should I do beauty therapy was like, well, do you want to do skin?

Yeah. Yeah. It's like, is that what you want to do or do you want to go and are you going to do this? You know, like, are, do you need to be learning how to map? Yep. And create that , and then also upskilling all the time because the look changes. The look changes, the product changes. Yeah. It's important to be all over it, but I, I think there's a bit of a fear of, of missing out, but if you're good at something, yeah.

Don't, don't jump, don't jump ship. Like, you know, it's gonna take you down a whole nother road. You're gonna have a draw full of stock that you half use, three quarters used, quarter used, and yeah. Stick with what you're good at to a degree and get that. And that's really important from a business aspect is really thinking about that and not just having staff consistency for the sake of having staff.

Yep, yep. I think where our, as a therapist, where I've explained this to brands, sometimes as they release a product, you gotta think you are, you started that and you're so far down the road, but your clients are coming in at step one. So don't, you know, overcomplicate it and think that they know anything.

They don't know anything. You are the expert. Take them on your journey and step one, and it's so true. I think so often we. We think because we, it feels so innate to know that, that everybody knows and everybody doesn't know. They don't know. No, they don't know. So yeah. Never undervalue the help, you know, the change you might make in somebody's life just by presenting one basics, small piece of information.

Yeah. But I, do you think then because of your background in like business and bookkeeping, that from the perspective of the people that are coming to you to look for support Yep. That you have that I, I feel like that would be a really well-rounded, yep. It's a all encompas ideal, encompassing kind of.

Yeah. And we do bring mentors in from time to time. We have an event in Melbourne every year that we, you know, have presenters of, I don't think Samara's gonna come next year and be a presenter for, so, sort of linking salons and who the expert is. Basically, we are not experts. We sell product.

Yes. We can't be everything to everybody as well, but. We're pretty well connected. So it's about yes, creating those connections and yeah, people putting people in touch with people to, to find their fit, you know, find their own. And that's, that's the thing with, with everything. Yep. It's about building connections.

Yep, absolutely. I was saying earlier, like, you know, rich was asking about , how do you navigate brands approaching you and things like that. And it happens regularly. I think two tanning brands reached out last week to to, to be stocked with us. And it's, yeah, it's not that easy. Like there's, it, it depends on the range and the brand, but we have existing relationships with our current brands.

And again, that's consistency too. Yes. It's about, it's about that balance of adding enough new things to keep people, those that are interested what's, what's new, what's different. And then like we put out email this morning, our, like a new arrivals one. And that would be the, the biggest open rate of all our emails.

Yes. It always is. You know, if people don't feel like they're being sold to and they just wanna passively see what's new, but yes, if we've got really good relationships with brands they are our most profitable relationships.

Yes. Like everyone at work is invested in not just me. I, I'm not on the shop floor, but all of our brands are, they get well supported by those brands. And yeah, so they, they're more likely to help, help promote them, I guess. Yeah. So do you have someone from the industry or who specializes in the different areas that you stock?

A little bit, yes. You know, we've got a, a beauty therapist on, on staff. Yeah. Someone else that's done beauty, but her, her love, her passion is nails. So yeah, we have a bit of a cross section of. Experts basically in what they do. And then do you have a cap on like how many different products per niche that you would offer?

Really? Is it really pretty fluid? Yeah. So and that's making sure that what you're adding is not detracting from the people that you've already held that relationship with. It's with point difference. Yeah. Okay. It's, it's got to talk to something that we're not talking to at the moment with the, with the current offering we have.

So, yeah. Yep. Absolutely. What do you think the next thing that we're gonna be talking to is? Like we said before, skin is, skin is the peak thing at the moment. Lash and brow. I think Lash and Brow is changing. I think a few people have tried to do the skin lighting things.

We've seen Kardashians with no brows, that sort of stuff. Yes. I think it fell flat on its face a bit, but people are still trying to bring out bleaching products which have been around for years. Bleaching products. Yeah, I don't know, it's maybe Mediterranean skin was really thick, solid brows wanna lighten them up a bit.

So I think so maybe that a bit. I definitely think skin. Is gonna evolve. It's not, you know, there's more machines, there's more, and not just like Marketo abrasion or, or microneedling. Yeah. I think there's gonna be other machines like the LED machines that, you know, handheld things are are, yeah.

If someone's not got one and they draw it home or something, I fallen down a rabbit hole with LED. Yeah. Yeah. I really have. It's easy to do, like I know, but I was starting with the face and then it, it's a client of mine, her granddaughter works in the beauty section of Herod's in London. Oh, okay. And so she's like nerd her, we need LED everywhere.

Everywhere. So she's got like one that you can roll out over your whole body Yep. For your butt and things like that. Yes. Yep. Absolutely. I mean, he's, that's a big thing, isn't it? Yeah. Brazilian butt lifts and things like that. Yep. And well, you've gotta look after that skin, so. Yep. And relatively non-invasive.

Yeah. I mean, the technology is, is incredible. What do we think about, I mean, there's a lot of stuff coming from the Korean skincare ground, Korean skin Yeah. As well, which I think has always been around. But I just don't think people realize that it was around. Yeah. And it just wasn't called, called that.

But, you know, Shiseido, all those sorts of brands have been around for years. Yeah. Glass sort of skin. I'm gonna say it's lightning to a degree, but it's, and that's probably why it's called the Cream one, because they really, they cover themselves up. But with Caucasians like me, it's about removing any brown spots, you know?

Yeah. Addressing all that sort of skin damage stuff. So, not so much that we want whiter skin, but we want it to be clearer. Oh, my cosmetic nurse is Filipino background. She has a huge Asian clientele. Yep. And in. The summer, they all come. 'cause she does like a lot of the IV drips and stuff like that, they all come and have this stuff in there.

It goes into their iv. Oh, okay. That like stops them from going brown. They do not want Wow. To be brown. To be brown as to be poor to them. Okay. Well that's where Tan came from, you know. Yeah. That was a, a tablet and changed the all chain in your skin and Yeah. Yeah. So, okay. As an ingest, well kind of ingestible isn't it, in terms of it's going into your veins, isn't it?

Wow. That's a lot of education involved there. That's a little bit more than skin penetration, like, you know, getting a skin penetration license, but even skin penetration licenses, like do you deal with much of the stuff involved with, not obviously getting them, but the products that people are using for those sorts of services?

Not really. We don't have a lot of skin penetration stuff. No. We don't deal in a lot of machines or anything. That's very, there's enough companies out there that specifically deal with that. Yeah. And it's, you know, it's education. The right education when you're selling it. Follow up education for sure.

A bit like skin in terms of big beauty houses that, you know, want to stick with just selling direct and selling an opening order of 15,000 or whatever like that. They don't wanna sell it to wholesalers like us. And that's fine. 'cause it's, I get it. You wanna support the seller and they wanna be, become indoctrinated in that brand and, and know it from where to go.

So we are more about, yep, you can keep your toe in. We have a skincare range that's beautiful. It's from Italy. So yeah, you can start off small. Start off small. Yeah. And, and build it. 'cause yeah, not everyone's got, you know. All that money to at 21 to open a shop. Like that's, it's not the journey for a lot of people.

Yeah. It's, it's slow to start up. Maybe in the middle it's the staff, 15 staff members in a big salon, and then it peter's back down again and they're going home and doing services outta room. They go, my God, I'm making more money than I was when I get 15 staff. So, yeah. Yeah. It's capturing people at the right point in their journey.

So, yeah. I, I have seen recently in Queensland we've had quite a, a big shift because there was a huge amount of change in compliance in terms of everything that was required for services that break the skin. Yeah. Yeah. And sadly, I've seen a lot of young people come really unstuck, that have started out in their early business journey, dermal clinicians mm-hmm.

Therapists. Yep. And have invested big money in, in talking to it, and now they can't. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Yeah. And they're really just, and it happened fairly quickly, so yeah, they, if they weren't aborted, they. Really struggling. People that were very busy on socials are just now like, I don't know what my voice is.

I don't know. I don't know how to do the before and I can't do before and afters. I don't know how to speak to it. I dunno what to speak to or about or Yeah. It has been challenging in terms of Yeah. What, yeah. So I guess it's coming back to being authentic. You just gotta, yeah. Whoever you are, just show up as whoever you are, which a lot of people are frightened to do, but Yeah.

Yeah, you, you'll find your people or your people will find you. Yeah. If you just as a authentic as you can be. So do you think that's the type of ideal that you set as a leader as well? Because I mean, you are a gm, you've got an all female team. No, we have about third male, two third female, third male.

I love that. Yep. It's a balance. So I'd like to say we have no drama queens in alpha males. So we're, you know, fairly cruisy. Don't quite fall asleep at the desk. But yeah, it's we all get along. Yeah. We don't live in each other's pockets though, you know, it's we don't do a lot of after hours things like, it's, it sounds funny, but, you know, I'm really cognizant of people just wanna get home.

You've got grandkids you wanna go. Yeah. Like, you know, you wanna pick your kids up from school or you know, I'm coming in late 'cause it's Father's Day. That's fine. You know? Is it to be balanced? I think it's been the, the awareness of who you I know because I'm a bit the same and Samara's the opposite.

Like, she just loves, like, her team love to be together 24 7. Like, they hang out outside of work. Yeah. And I'm just like, Hmm, no, I wanna go home guys, peace out. Yeah. Have a dinner at six and then bed by eight 30. So, yeah. Yeah, we, we work to live, you know? Yeah. So that's, I don't know, that's, that's me.

So maybe that's permeated a bit. And the sort of people that we've, that work with us and yeah. And then how have you found, like your team, so you've got people specializing in a few different things. Yep. But how have you built that team around and like what are, what's your goal and aim for the business that you have?

Obviously, like you've condensed things down, finish things down. It's a lot online. I think just becoming a bit smarter and keeping ahead of the trends in terms of digital stuff. So yeah, that's everyone, you know, COVID made everyone digital. Yeah. You, you couldn't help. But, so, that's the reason why we sort of closed our showrooms.

We just, the traffic through the door was less. They'd moved online and they had to do it. They go, oh, that wasn't so hard. You know, that was a good experience. And our strength has always been in brands and distribution. So we were probably one of the first multi-brand distributors. So a lot of, when we sort of started a lot of wholesalers just had one brand of nails, one brand of wax, one brand of, i'm not gonna say hair care, but Yeah. Tint or things like that. Where we had multiple it, it's changed now. There's lots that, have multiple brands. We've sort of learned content is king online in, in terms of product.

People wanna know the ingredients and things and stuff like that. So really beefing up all of that. People are far more savvy. Yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, you only have to, and I, I think it's even more important now for us to be providing that sort of information because I see not great information and it's like, okay, well we have responsibility to put the information out that is,

true and accurate researched, and it's a new generation that yeah, were brought up on Google and just they know how to research and where to get the information from. Yeah. And they'll call you out on it if, if it's not there or they're not happy with ingredient one, two, or three, like in the top of list.

So yes, yes. They've a different audience that we're speaking to. So beefing that up to make sure that we've got all the right content. You know, we're gonna have to go and start leveraging AI soon to which you do sort of content in, in wordy things, but I think even digitally graphics and things, are you outsourcing this or is this something that you're trying build within your team?

Yeah. We outsource quite a few little things, uh, in expertise, whether it's SEO stuff or a little bit of our social media we outsource. We've just got someone who I'm onboarding at the moment who's from a very digital world. Mm-hmm. So. We are leveraging her expertise in what that looks like.

'cause that hasn't been traditionally our strong point because it hasn't needed to be. Yeah. So we rely on the brands to create a marketplace and then we, we great at distribution and getting the product, the right product at the right price at the right time. But thing, but you've recognized now that that is something that it's evolving.

Yeah. Yep. So are you then creating more digital stuff for your brands? Yes. Does that then, uh, no. Not for our brands. 'cause they have their own, they have their own image and stuff too, I think as our brand. And I think that's again where we fall. Yeah. What does our brand look like? How do you know, what's its point of difference and how do we stand out?

We can't just look like our brands. And that's so interesting 'cause this is something that's relevant to all the businesses that we speak to as well. Like, so what do you think it, what do you think your brand is? What makes you different? It's hard. Yeah.

What makes us different? I think our length of time in industry Yeah. And seeing those trends. And we, we, we still have out of, we've got 12 staff members, I'm gonna say five or six of them are like 10 years plus. Yeah. So that speaks to, there's a lot of history there in, we've seen things come and go and, you know, but it also speaks to the consistency that your business can provide.

Yes. You know what I mean? Yeah. 'cause you've had that really strong foundation and consistent growth. Yep. And with the same people, not Yeah. Changing all the time. And I think that permeates sell ons too. Like we say, be consistent in your, in your approach. Come and talk to us like we are, we're, we are consistent.

Yeah. You'll see the same faces, you know, it, we do mix it up, but Yeah. But do you think too then in like changing and growing in your digital reach. It's kind of like a social proof for those people that you're trying to support that No, we really do know what we are talking about. Right? Yes. And we can help you.

Yeah. And we've got the knowledge and the information. Just look at all the digits. Yes. Or if we don't, then we'll connect you with it. Then we'll connect you with it. That's like, yeah. We're, we also realize that we can't be everything to everybody. We are not. We are not mentors, we're not growth partners in that, that sense to help you.

But you can be that pathway That's right. To finding the next person that's gonna support with that. And when you've developed the relationship with people where they feel comfortable to say like, I'm actually struggling with this a little bit. Yep. And you can be like, I know the person for you in touch with somebody, you need to need to step over here.

Yeah. So we're gonna formalize that a bit more and we are just really gonna have a sort of a partner's approach through our digital platforms to Yeah. To help connect salons with that. So, 'cause we realize, I don't dunno where to go if you're, if you are at home by yourself. Yes. And even hairdressing is probably different to beauty.

Again, you're not really talking to your clients in beauty. Where do you go for that help? Where do you, you know, you sit on the couch at night t trawling through stuff and it's a little bit hit and miss, but come and talk us. Are you gonna find, yeah. Are you gonna find the people that are actually gonna help you or you listening to what they're selling you?

You know what I mean? Or, yeah. Yep. Absolutely. So what sort of partnerships are you looking at entering into? Quite a few different varieties. One, so we've already entered in a few that are training related. Yeah. So someone Isabel GaN, who's the resident beauty expert on Channel seven, she's does book our massage like, which is Interoral facial Massage.

And that, oh my gosh. I so had want to get that done. I had a massage with her and it was just amazing. I'm, I'm a jaw clincher and yes, just you hold all your attention in your face and your jaw. She's amazing. Anyway, we've sort of partnered with her a bit. Wow. Supporting her. This is not product related. It doesn't, you know.

You get a, you get back what you put out there. Agreed. I big. So just helping her with uh, 'cause she wants to access our, our customers, you know, because she doesn't wanna deal with the public. It's already beauty therapists that just wanna upskill a bit more. So it's those that wanna upskill. There's beef and detox method in Melbourne.

She does, uh, lymphatic, I like to use the word drainage, but lymphatic drainage, massage techniques. Yep. And that sort of, and I think wellness is going to be big and bigger in terms of Yeah. Gut health. Looking from the inside in. And I don't think there's enough salons that do that enough. Uh, we're timely partners as well, so, same.

Yeah. Yeah, same. Lovely. Cherry put us in touch. Yes. So yeah, she's amazing and all that she does in the wellness space. I love it. Oh yeah. Yeah. And it just again, speaks to that connection of people are looking for that whole picture. Yeah. Not just supporting their business, but supporting them as people.

Yeah. And yeah. Yeah. Growth in all areas, right? That's right. Yep. And a few business partners, uh, a few business coaches. We've, we've dealt with a few over time. Some are very different, some are very, I think everyone is really different. Yeah. You have to find your person that's, yeah. And it's a little bit hard, but how do you find your person, show up to events, listen to podcasts, you'll kind of Yeah.

Start to resonate with the right people. That was the whole reason we started this podcast was that it's just that gives people who are perhaps sitting on the fence about who you are. To get an insight into who Samara is as a person, the conversations that they're having with everybody or anybody or whoever's next to them.

Yeah, yeah. How they get speak to things. So it's very helpful. But yeah, some of them are really wordy and sweary like, you know, and they sort of, and that resonates with some people. Exactly. Some of them are, that are a little bit older school that just wanna talk to skin clinics that with a multiple team, that sort of thing.

So yeah, we've partnered with a few of those. So there's about eight sort of companies at the moment that we've kind of partnered with loosely that I think is working. And so we're sort of gonna try and pull that in and sort of formalize it a bit and yeah. Structured area on our website where they, they can sort of sit and Yeah.

That's really nice. Yeah. It's, it's, I think it's gonna work. It's a bit of a symbiotic two-way relationship and Yeah, exactly. Supports the industry. You know, trade shows are changing, like how, how do you find these people? It used to be trade shows and. Yeah, but they're changing. So interestingly, 'cause I was at my first sort of like trade show with hair festival that I've been to for a long time.

Like probably, I think it's probably my first one post COVID. Okay. Potentially up here or Sydney? It was in Sydney. Yep. And it felt like times of old, like it actually was like, oh, this feels like it kind of used to feel like, so what do you think is happening in terms of like trade shows for the beauty industry?

What do you think is happening with the industry itself? Like I think it's nicheing. Yeah, I think it's very nicheing. I hear the word community a lot, but I hear it from younger people. I don't know, I think we've, community's always been there, but I don't think anyone that's raised on a phone necessarily.

Recognizes that. Like they, maybe they haven't. So they're, they're creating their own events. We, we support and sponsor through goodie bag things and stuff like that. A lot of little, there was lash and Sip on the weekend with Jennifer and that was, you know, lash girlies getting out and just having a good night out.

Like, I'm going to another one in Melbourne soon. Again, it's, it's lash and brown sort of people trying to attract that industry of person, but not, they're also inviting business mentors and a few other people. Yeah. I think purposely so I think just to get them all in the room over a casual dinner.

Lunch. So niching definitely, and I, these brands used to, or these salons used to talk to us and say, you should do that sort of thing, but we're, what we're finding is they're doing it. Yes. They're not waiting for us to do it, and that's fine. Like, that's as it should be like. Yeah. And you are supporting it, like you're offering support Yeah.

Going along. Yeah. Happy to advertise it, happy to, you know, support it and promote it. Yeah, because do you think that. In to like, people are niching their services, but do you think that the industry, like beauty industry is really niching in terms of size as well? Like there's a, there's a big conversation about this happening in hair at the moment of like, you know, is there still a place for big salon ons?

Is everyone gonna go booth rental or chair rental? You know, like where are things sitting? I think it's different for beauty because for us, like I worked by myself, but I wanted to train young people. Therefore I knew that I needed to have a salon. Yeah, you needed a space.

Yeah. I needed a space to be able to do that. But I mean, with beauty it's a little bit different because it's more of a solo journey. Even if you're working for someone, it be, yes. Yep. Yes. Because it's very much one-on-one Yeah. In a room with you and your clients. So I think there's not a lot of overlap.

There's not a lot of communal space. Yeah. Services or techniques? Yes. I think it's, it's a conversation of both sides, but I think there's and that's just speaks to the journey of the person too about Yeah. You know, they're kind of at the point where they're how do I grow anymore or do I need to Yeah.

Have a team around me. What does that look like? And different people like different things, right? Yes. Some people thrive individually. Yep. I suppose it depends where they're at in their lives. We were talking about this earlier 'cause both, you know, your children have been through their journey now and they are heading out into their own journey as young adults.

So as young adults. Yes. Yeah. Hopefully I've raised them. Will

and

off you go. Yes. And I'm sort of getting to the pointier end of that as well. Do you feel like when you changed. Did that change, like work-wise for you? Yes. Uh, yes. And that's probably one of the reasons I'm still there too, because we, yeah.

I didn't take that much time off, but yeah. My transition back was slow. And then when my daughter started school, I changed those hours again to be Yeah, right. I'll work another day, but I'll cut it back the hours and I'll finish and pick her up at school from 3, 3 30, whatever it was. So, yes. Yeah.

Yeah. And I think you have to, you have to, these days you have to do that for your own mental health. And if you want a good team, yes. You have to, you have to respect that people have lives and different things are important to different people. Yeah. You know, yours might be monetary and you want to earn the most amount of money.

Yours might be time, yours might be, you know, just want, just wanna be seen and thanked and heard, you know, or time and money. What an accommodation of the truth. Yeah, true. Quite nice. It's quite nice. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Who's, who's paying and who's receiving it. Yes. You know, it's always a different thing, but yeah.

As long as you're getting the most out of the, the staff member. Yeah. Yeah. Because I think too, when, when you, especially with beauty, that's where the people are perhaps, you know, setting up their studio at home you know, for that flexibility or, or quite the opposite. And perhaps they've had that, but then with home life, they're looking to get out and have a space that they can get away to.

And I think they, you know, you always think that bigger is better too. And so I think that's how that evolves too. And then we've seen salons. 'cause again, we've had long-term relationships with a lot of our customers, then they shrink back down and they go, oh my God, I've just, I'm, I'm, I've got a room in my house now versus the, the 15 staff I had in cell.

And yeah, I feel I'm, I feel better in myself. I'm making just as much money as I was then. Less stress. Yeah. You know, of having to manage all those bodies. So it depends. People, maybe if you're starting out, you might think that that's, I'm, I'm small. Like they, they sort of shrink a bit. At the thought of that and think that they look up to these people with a, a big staff lots of staff and think that that's the end goal, but necessarily big staff, big stress necessarily.

Big staff, big stress. That's right. And not necessarily yeah, you don't necessarily make more money out of it, so. Yeah. Yes. Yep. Bookkeeper. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a numbers person, so Yeah. I like numbers. They don't lie, you know, they are what they are. They're black and white and yeah. Yeah. It's managing to read between the lines to work out the story behind numbers sometimes and where they lead you to.

Yes. So, yeah. People have such a fear of numbers. Numbers can be your friend. Numbers don't lie. I think that's the catchphrase we're gonna take today. Numbers don't lie. Yep. Absolutely. Know your numbers. Yeah. It's not, it doesn't need to be overwhelming. It's, yeah. Yeah. And it's in everything. It's, it's the number of clients you have, what their average spend is 'cause all that we'll talk to will.

You're not making enough money, then who, who do you wanna, what do you wanna charge? Yeah. In order to walk away with, so who can afford to pay that? Who, who is your ideal client then? Yeah. So start speaking to that. Don't be afraid to cut clients out of your life. , If they're not serving you.

So, yeah. Yeah. It's about having clients that value Absolutely. You. Yep. If, you know, there's no point in trying to attract people that don't see any value in you. Yep. Absolutely. So, yep. So they're just not for you. They can go to whatever they value, there's someone for everyone.

Absolutely. There is a value level for everybody. Yep. So we don't have to please everybody that all traditional, you know, oh, I can get those lash extensions cheaper down the road, then do it. Off you go. Yeah, off you go. Because I'm not, you know, I value my time and so should you Yeah. I charge it for a reason because my kids have ballet.

My, you know, I have a life after. I have to pay everybody and I have to service myself and Yes. Yeah. So that's, everyone needs to think about that, not just, it's interesting. I need to walk away with $25 an hour after this. Like, it's not about that. Yeah. It's interesting that, and, 'cause I just see this all the time in socials, people complaining about stuff, but like it's little things

I have a cleaner.

I always advocate for people having a cleaner. I think you should outsource whatever you can, but my cleaner makes a really good hourly rate and nobody seems to complain about that. Like, you never see people on social media complaining about how much they, about what the cleaner charges Yeah. Charges.

Yep. Because don't let hair get away for that because Yeah. You know, like, yeah. Yep. Because you value it. It's, yeah. Yes. The value, because it's placed on it. It's my time. Yep. Absolutely. That the value of that money is giving me my time. And so yeah, I just, it's a really, really interesting, interesting conversation when you start getting into.

Yeah, where numbers can take you. It's not just, it's not just profitability. It's, yeah. Yeah. Because value is value. Like yeah, you put the, you put the education in and did the hard yards and Yeah. Had to, had to work cheap, I guess to start with, to, to make, you know, to, to get a foot in. But when you get there, work out what your value is and don't be shy about it.

So with your, sorry, I digress 'cause I just popped my little brain. Just popped back to the partnerships. How did you decide who you were gonna partner with? I try to partner with people that I've met. Definitely. Yeah. Like I don't just do randoms, so please don't approach me because that would be an awkward conversation over Instagram.

Look, it's just people I resonate with. Like two years ago I went to a timely event before expo and sat in the audience and watched B from detox method in Melbourne do this amazing thing. And I go, oh, I go, where is it? And it's MBO Morris, which is like 10 minutes round. Corner from my house in at home.

So, she's probably my age, maybe a little bit younger, so I just resonated with her and yeah, her approach and that whole wellness, it just, I'm a bit of a science person too. Maybe math and science was my thing. Nothing to do with beauty and things, but and so the whole science behind lymphatic, uh, massage and drainage spoke to me.

So I kind of connected with her afterwards and it's like, oh my God. She, like, she just, she gets me like, you know? Yeah. Yeah. So you just wanna find people that get you. So yeah, I just start having conversations with people. I go to events where I possible, you know, yeah, I have FOMO about events and I'm not gonna know anybody on the, anyway, at that time of the event, I literally just walked in the door and said, ladies, I don't know anybody here.

Can I send, can I talk to you? And yeah, it was that 10 seconds of fear and then it's done. And they were like, oh, yeah. You know, very welcoming and things so. Going to events, sitting next to people. You know, Isabel GaN I had sat next to an event and started talking to, and started messaging her and yeah, same.

She's younger than me. I know, 'cause she told me how old she was. But she's just speaks real like Yeah, she's very authentic and she has a very high aesthetic. But she's, and she lives in barrel and which is, you know, even she finds she doesn't fit it in barrel. Like, you know, just yeah. Just trying to find people that are authentic and it's hard to sell People that I don't think are authentic or I don't get exactly right, or Yeah.

That you have to have trust and face in them. I, that means it's still gonna be a fit for everybody. But yeah, like I said, tomorrow will be a fit for some people, but not a fit for other people. So, yeah, I know exactly what you mean with that. I went, when I went down to hair festival, I. Decided spur, like spur of the minute that I was going to go to, we had like an industry, a couple of days, industry event with the Australian Hairdressing Council.

Okay. And I messaged Sherry from timely. Yeah. Because I was like, oh, stuff it, I'm just gonna do it. 'cause I was going by myself. Like normally I have my security blanket of at least Samara or Richard would be when we go, yeah. Hold your hand with And which isn't, which can sometimes work to our detriment because we.

Are quite introverted in big crowds. Yep. And will mean that, 'cause we've got that safety net. We won't necessarily talk to people, but I was like, no, I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna get off that plane and I'm gonna go to this event. And I was messaging Sherry and I was just like, oh my gosh, I'm gonna freak out.

Oh, I feel I'm gonna throw up in my mouth. Oh, why have I gotten myself into this? I can't believe I'm gonna walk into a room with all these times. She's like, it's fine, I'll talk to you. I'm like, okay, okay. And then, okay, yep. It's gonna be okay. And much like you, it's like got there, like walked off the plane, dropped my bag, walked to this event and was like, okay, I'm here.

Here. We're doing it. Just like the penguins off Madagascar just smile and wave. Voice, smile and wave. I love that love, love that line. Just yeah. When you, when you doubt, just smile and wave. But you do like you have to, you have to put, you have to be in the room. Yeah. It's not even about putting yourself out there.

Just stand at the back if you, if you're really shy, but just get in the room because. There are amazing people in our industry and that's the best way to find them is. Yeah. And if you wanna see where things are going and you want to be part of where things are heading, you need to be in the room.

Absolutely. Yeah. Yep. And everyone. And it, and it will spark something that you didn't even think you needed, or Yeah. That wasn't even on your radar. So, and even sometimes I say, 'cause I've heard people say, oh, you know, but you go to these things and it's all the same thing. It's like, yeah, but are you doing it?

Yeah. 'cause sometimes it's just hearing that same thing again, that's gonna be like, oh, I've really gotta do that. Yeah. That's the 17th time I've heard this and I still haven't actioned it. Yeah. That, you know, that one, that one time that you're in the room, they say it one. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. And it's might resonate the 15th time you've heard it.

Yeah. Is you said slightly differently or you sat next to someone who goes, oh my God, isn't she amazing? And I've tried that in my business and you go, really have you? How, how did you do it? And that's how you find out. So get in the room girls. So Yeah. Yeah. 100%. Yep. And the events, and I know trade show is a bit, you know, I'm not saying tired.

It does feel a lot, not a lot's changed in trade shows, but Yeah. And nothing offense. They're still as expensive as it used to be. And at the end of the, it's marketing dollars. So Yeah. Where people choose to put their marketing dollars changes. Do you attend or do you have something at trade shows? Uh, we used to have something at trade show, but no, we don't post COVID.

We don't, we uh, I think we had signed up for Melbourne Trade Show, post COVID and then it got sort of pushed back and pushed back. 'cause you know, COVID was a whole thing in Melbourne and then never came back. So, yeah. And then we kind of just gone, Hmm. I went to, none of us wanted to go to the first Sydney trade show 'cause I don't think anyone really wanted to be in the building with that many people.

That was a whole thing coming outta Melbourne. Yeah. We were all frightened to death. And it was like, oh, it's really small, but, you know, it's still the same money. The, there's, the traffic's not here. Yeah. So yeah, we probably won't go back to trade show unless we do something niche maybe. Yeah.

Okay. But now I just go to trade shows to catch up with people and that's more valuable, the connections. And I feel like that's the direction that I see those things going in. Like, you've got, you, you've still have your core little trade show, whatever it is. Yep. But it's all those other little, the micro events, micro events that are happening around, happening around them.

Yep. Sponsored by particular brands. Yep. That like, that's that community Yep. Connection building, that's where people are wanting Yep. To go. You've still got that much smaller aspect of. Sales per se. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, I really do think that that's the movement and the direction that if people are wanting to do something around that, that's where you get the bums and seeds.

Do you agree? Yep. Absolutely. Yep. Yep. You don't know what partnership's gonna take you down a certain road or where people are at, or and I think for us as a product supplier, like I said, we have good relationships with the brands we've got. That doesn't mean that we are, we're not adding brands, but we need to find other ways to connect people to us.

And so we, we are doing it through people partnerships and Oh, I like that. Yeah. People, partnerships yeah, mentors and yeah, uh, gurus, I don't know what what's the good word for them, but yeah, a guru, you know, get, get a guru in your life whether it's finances you need help with, which we all need help with because clearly we didn't enter the beauty industry.

Because we wanted to do finances. Yeah. Like we don't, we want to be tangible and tactile and no one wants to do pedicures, but yeah. We wanna, we want to. That was not what we signed up for. Yeah. You realize when you have a business, that's what you need. So yeah. Putting people in touch with those sorts of people and Yeah.

Yes. Trying to tick all the boxes. We always try to tick all the boxes with product, but Yeah. We're just trying to go, you're running a business. What does that mean in terms of staff and Well, you're looking advertising and Well, you're looking at the people that are coming to you more as an ecosystem rather than just like an individual because it's, if you support, like with nature and, 'cause obviously everyone's far more into nature, hopefully now than they used to be.

If you support that entire ecosystem around that singular Yep. Then that's when everything, it flourishes. Everything flourishes. Yep. Yep. You put a little dome on top of it and it just waters itself and Yeah. Absolutely. So that's. People, partnerships is where we're headed. So yeah, I, which all travels back to product.

The end of the day. We all have to use product. So yes. I don't wanna do us out of a, a disservice out of a job, but yes, we're so you were saying before that everybody's got a product, everybody's got a product and it's a bit scary. It's a bit scary. So yeah, everybody's got something that they wanna give you and just expect that they can put on the shelf with you and it's like, nah, that's not the way it works or the thing.

Yeah. So come and have a relationship with us because obviously they have to build the relationship, but then on after the relationship, is there a step where it's like, okay, now we actually. Because I think as we identified you've got like that mathematical and science brain. It's like you can have a great relationship with someone and still think I'm not sold by what you are presenting to me.

Yep. It's might just not be the right time. Yeah. And I've had those conversations before going, yep, it looks like a good product. It's just not packaged well enough. You know? Yeah. I've sent people away with that too and and good on, and their persistence and they've gone away and come back. There's a lady in Melbourne that we're dealing with with uniforms and a year ago she came to me and showed me, this is my passion.

I wanna present uniforms to salons and they're very aesthetic. They were linen and it's like, you know, just where's the movement? Like, you gotta remember people are massaging people, yeah. So she went away for a year and came back and it's like, okay, yeah, that, that's closer to the mark.

And it's like, well we don't really wanna sell uniforms 'cause. There's sizing and colors and, but what about we just direct traffic to you? You know, like, why don't we connect our customers to you yeah. So that's how we're Yeah. But that was a purposeful one. We don't have a uniform. We don't sell clothing or apparel, so Yeah.

That was, but salons need that, or there's a time of life where they do they want to, so that's connecting the right people. There's a big shift in that at the moment, actually. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Hers is very, spar aesthetic, you know? Yeah. That whole talking to the dermal clinician, like we said earlier.

Yeah, yeah. It's not pink and green but there's, you know, people, colors are so important these days because it's all to do with branding. Yes. And, yep. If your color is orange, then everything is orange and you Yeah. Lash and brow bars tend to bring out orange brushes. Like, you know, they'll release a range of their own things, which that's fine too.

That's very true. Because I have just taken on a new range of my salon. Did then have to purchase everything aesthetically to match it. So when my technician and rep came in the other day and they're like, oh my gosh, even your combs and your clips match. I'm like, I know. I wanted to be completely on brand.

It's for your own mental health too. Yeah. Like if, you know, it's, it's a little bit of OCD kind of, that just doesn't match. It's just screaming clash sort of thing. So Yeah. But speaking of the clash, that was one of the other things I noticed being in that work environment that was trying to combine the hair and the beauty is that we had a specific aesthetic that we were supposed to dress to.

Oh, okay. So, which was all neutral palette, no color. Everything had to be like beige pretty much. Yeah. It's very hard to be a hairdresser and have everything beige. Yeah. Yep. Hard to be Ian, have everything. Can you imagine Ians like the, the dust all over them and just Yeah, that doesn't work either. And they're very colorful and there's not really too many neutral nails out there that, you know.

Yeah. That's not what you're known for. You know what I mean? French is okay, but everyone can do French, but not the bright colors and yeah, faces on nails and things like that. So yeah, it's, you Things have to have a niche, so yeah. Yeah. If we've got something that is young and funky and bright and colorful, that speaks to something that might be enough of a point of difference for us to, yeah, to onboard it.

But you know, it has to, it has to serve a purpose. It has to be. Yeah, yeah. Has to do something different to everything else or else I'm just carving out the pie and giving it to someone else. And that's not, not fair to our current brands who, you know, we've worked hard with all this time. They put the work in, they put the work in, they put the ingredients into that pie.

Absolutely. They deserve, have slice. We're not all about that. We're not, you know, we're not making it. We're not the chemist. But yes, that's your forte. Ours is getting it to you at the right price. Yeah. At the right time. Just in time. So, yeah. Excellent. I love that. Yeah. Oh, thank you. So there's been just so many insightful takeaways from our chat today and I think that yeah, it's really lovely to speak to someone who's seen such an evolution in the industry and is still excited to keep evolving as you move forward.

Absolutely. Yeah. And I think that's one of the biggest lessons and takeaways that I think people should have is just because you've always been in a certain place, been doing things a certain way doesn't mean that there doesn't come a time where you're like, okay, and now we pivot. The only way you're gonna grow is if you're uncomfortable.

Yeah. So you've got to get comfortable with being uncomfortable. That's it. And just, yep. You'll start to grow. So Yep. Get out, get it in the room where you don't really wanna go. Yeah. And you'll take something away from it. So, yeah. Well, I really appreciate you coming and getting in the room with us today.

Thank you for inviting me on. It's lovely. I really have enjoyed our chat. Thank you so much. That's, and I apologize that my friend could not be here today to join us. It's alright. But, uh, we had to pivot and grow and get uncomfortable and we did. Okay. Thanks Jen. Thank you. Yeah, thank you so much for coming on and thanks so much for listening guys.

We will be back very soon. Have a good day.